Scheduled Games for Sunday
1846: The Race for the Midwest, 8:00am to 1:00pm -- Hosted by Marius van der Merwe
Number of players: 2-5, Run time: 3-5 hours
Description: 1846 is an18xx train game set in the Midwestern United States.This game has a reputation as a good entry point into the 18xx genre. Its focus is more on route building than stock market shenanigans, and for an 18xx game, plays relatively quickly. If you ever wondered what the 18xx hype is all about, this is your chance to find out. However, you should probably stay away if you hate math and numbers crunching!
Marvel Legendary, 8:00am to 11:00am -- Hosted by Charlie Zerilli
Number of players: 1-4, Run time: 60-90 Minutes
Marvel Legendary is a Deck Building game using Marvel Comics Super Heroes, Masterminds, and Villains. It is cooperative on a main mission, with each player also earning individual victory points to try and become the overall winner. Planning to play two runs of the game.
Reel Royale, (Game demos all day) -- Hosted by Andrew Smith
4 players (or more, if the players aren't new to the game) and a session usually runs a little less than half an hour.
Choose-your-character fighting card game, and all the characters are based off of old SciFi/Horror B movies.
Tokaido (Deluxe Edition), 8:00am to 11:00am -- Hosted by Rik Fontana
Number of players: 2-5, Run time: 2 games, about 90 minutes each
Take a journey through Japan and become the most traveled player. Easy to learn rules. Beginner & experienced players welcome.
Transatlantic, 8:00am to 10:30am -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) 2 to 4 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 3.15
b) 21/2 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) In Transatlantic, 2 to 4 players lead their own shipping companies, which transport freight, mail, and passengers around the globe. They purchase new steamships from the market, each of them historical with their individual technical data (tons, knots etc.). Competition is tough, especially in the North Atlantic where winning the "Blue Riband" is not only a matter of prestige, but may also be a profitable investment. In order to let a shipping company flourish, purchasing the best steamships is not enough, if one fails to acquire enough coal bunkers and trade posts as well.The game is driven by cards; on each turn, play one card and execute the related action. As new cards enter the game, build your individual deck of cards with new or improved possibilities. The task is to manage your merchant fleet most efficiently. It's a maritime strategy game with low luck, lots of interactive choices, and tough decisions.
Heroes of Kaskaria, 10:00am to 11:00am -- Hosted by Alex Bernard
Number of players: 2 - 4, Run time: 30 minutes (will run this game twice)
Easy game, beginners welcome
Evil trolls have stolen the treasure of the ancestors and the magical tribal amulet, now the Kaskarians fear the wrath of their ancestors. Brave heroes immediately set off with flying scaled griffins and fast cliff runners to reach the trolls' lair which lies at the bottom of the volcanic crater. The hero who plays their action cards cleverly, rescues as much treasure as possible, and snatches the magic amulet back from the evil trolls will become the big hero of Kaskaria!
Keyper, 11:00am to 1:30pm -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) 2 to 4 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 3.65
b) 2 1/2 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) Keyper is a worker placement game. (Keyper is the eighth new title in the medieval Key series of games, with Keydom, the second in the series being widely recognized as the first of the worker placement genre of games.) What makes Keyper special is that when one player places a keyple on a country board, another player can join them with a matching colored keyple on the first player's turn to the benefit of both players. In this way some players are likely to have played all their keyples before others. All keyples have the potential to work twice. If a player has played all of their keyples, but another player still has some, then on their turn the player with no remaining keyples can lay down one or more keyples on the country board they have claimed or in their village board to secure additional resources or actions. It can therefore be doubly beneficial to co-operate with your fellow players, although Keyper is not a co-operative game in the usual sense of the term.The country boards are also noteworthy in that they can be manipulated and folded at the beginning of summer, autumn and winter to show one of four different permutations of fields for that season. A player will chose the one to suit their strategy, often hoping that another player will complement their choice. Certain fields on the country boards are available only in certain seasons, e.g., raw materials can be upgraded to finished goods only in spring and summer after which you can only convert using tiles in your own village. Gem mining occurs only in autumn and winter.
A player's strategy is likely to be influenced by which (seeded) spring country tiles they acquire and by the particular colored keyples they have available in the later seasons. Different combinations will encourage a player to develop their farm or village, help with their shipping or mining activities, and prepare for the seasonal fairs. Players constantly need to evaluate whether or not to join other players, when to claim a country board, whether to play on their own or another player's country board, when to use their own village, and whether to create a large or small team of keyples for the following season. The winner is the player to gain the most points, usually through pursuing at least a couple of the different strategies.
In addition to the theme and mechanisms, Keyper has similar traits to the earlier Key games: Game actions are positive and constructive, not destructive; player interaction is through the game mechanisms not direct, and like Keyflower, the previous game in the series, there is a lot of player interaction.
Mage Wars, 11:00am to 2:00pm -- Hosted by Jessica Burgess
Number of players: 2-4, Run time: 2-3 hours
Mages battle to the death in an arena of magic, creatures, and traps.
Terraforming Mars, 11:00am to 2:00pm -- Hosted by Kory West
Number of players: Up to 5, Run time: 2-3 hours.
Players are corporations working to raise the temperature, place oceans, and raise the oxygen on Mars. There are many paths to victory for your corporation. You must choose wisely, what projects you sponsor and how you manage your Megacredits. There are milestones to claim and awards to fund to help you on your way to victory. I hope to have the new Venus Next Expansion!
Mansions of Madness (1st Edition), 11:00am to 2:00pm -- Hosted by John Snow
Number of players: 2 -5, Run time: 3 hrs
One vs. all haunted mansion mystery, cthulu mythos;
Anachrony, 2:00pm to 6:00pm -- Hosted by Brett Peterson
Number of players: 1-4, Run time: 4 hours
Anachrony features a unique two-tiered worker placement system. To travel to the Capital or venture out to the devastated areas for resources, players need not only various Specialists (Engineers, Scientists, Administrators, and Geniuses) but also Exosuits to protect and enhance them — and both are in short supply.
The game is played in 4-7 turns, depending on the time when the looming cataclysm occurs. The elapsed turns are measured on a dynamic Timeline. By powering up the Time Rifts, players can reach back to earlier turns to supply their past "self" with resources. Each Path has a vastly different objective that rewards it with a massive amount of Victory Points when achieved. The Paths' settlements will survive the impact, but the Capital will not. Whichever Path manages to collect most points will be the new seat for the Capital.
Anachrony is a heavy worker placement game that takes about 4 hours to play.
Emperor's Choice, 2:00pm to 4:30pm -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) 3 to 5 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 3.00
b) 2 1/2 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) In 221 BC, Emperor Qin Shihuang finally united China after a long period of internal conflict in which China was divided by warring provinces. With this unprecedented authority, Emperor Qin made a number of influential lasting reforms and carried out impactful large-scale projects which would last for centuries. Players are powerful subordinates of the Emperor, promoting the Emperor’s various policies and projects while manipulating their own standing within the Imperial Court. To do so, they need to build sections of the Great Wall, amass troops and carriages, recruit philosophers and academics as well as collect important literature. Players will also need to employ and properly utilize characters within the Imperial Court. Which player can exert the greatest influence and make their achievements go down in the annals of history?The player with the most victory points (VP) at the end of 6 rounds will be the winner. Players earn VP by presenting their achievements according to the Emperor’s policies. However, the Emperor’s policies are constantly subject to influence and change…
Taiwanese designer and a really good game!
Long Shot, 7:00pm to 8:00pm -- Hosted by Tobyn Degraw
Long Shot
3-8 players
approx 1 hour play
Welcome to the races. Gamblers and horse owners bet on horses and try to push their horse into the lead. This is a family friendly game for ages 10 and up, that involves pretend gambling.
Pandemic, 2:00pm to 3:30pm -- Hosted by John Snow
Number of players: 2 - 4 players, Run time: 1.5 hrs (including teaching time)
Cooperative game of fighting disease around the world.
Panamax, 2:00pm to 4:00pm -- Hosted by Rob Ruppert
Number of players: 2-4, Run time: 2 hours
In Panamax each player manages a shipping company established in the Colón Free Trade Zone. Companies accept contracts from both US coasts, China and Europe and deliver cargo in order to make money, attract investment and pay dividends. At the same time the players accumulate their own stock investments and try to make as much money as possible in an effort to have the largest personal fortune and win the game.
On their turn, players remove a die from the Action table to select Contracts and Load Cargo or Move ships until the pool of dice is emptied ending the Round. Over the course of three rounds these actions are blended during the turn to create a logistics network which the players use to ship their cargo, minimize transportation fees and increase the net worth of their Companies. Each Company has a limited amount of Stock that the players can purchase in exchange for investing—receiving a dividend each round. The questions for the players will be which companies are likely to yield higher dividends?
There’s more to explore and several ways to win, but we ask that you join us at the table and celebrate the 100th Anniversary of the Panama Canal with a session of Panamax!
Ticket To Ride, 2:00pm to 3:30pm -- Hosted by Joel Cottam
Dominion, 3:30pm to 5:00pm -- Hosted by Joel Cottam
Ticket To Ride
Number of players: 2-5, Run time: 1 hour
You have tickets to your destination! Fulfill those tickets by matching train cards and placing your pieces on the tracks.
Dominion
Number of players: 2-4, Run time: about 30 minutes per game
You are a monarch trying to build your kingdom by collecting card actions so you can get more gold and acquire more land. Deck building game.
Catacombs, 5:00pm to 7:00pm -- Hosted by John Snow
Number of players: 2 - 5 players, Run time: 2 hrs (including teaching time)
One vs. all dexterity (disc flipping) dungeon crawl
Gentes, 5:00pm to 7:30pm -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) 2 to 4 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 3.19
b) 2 1/2 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) Gentes is an interesting civilization game with an innovative timing mechanism."Gentes" is the Latin plural word for greater groups of human beings (e.g., tribes, nations, people; singular: "gens"). In this game, players take the role of an ancient people who are attempting to develop by building monuments and colonizing or founding new cities in the Mediterranean sea.
The game is played in six rounds, each consisting of two phases: action phase, and tidying up. There are three eras — rounds 1-2, 3-4, 5-6 — with new monument cards entering the game at the beginning of rounds 1, 3 and 5. Each player has a personal player mat with a time track for action markers and sand timer markers. In the action phase of a round, the players take their turns in clockwise order, conducting one action per turn. Each action requires an action marker from the main board that is placed on the time track. Depending on the information on the action marker, you have to also pay some money or take sand timers that are placed on the time track. When you have no free spaces on your time track, you must pass for the remainder of the round. Therefore, the number of actions per player in a single round may vary significantly if, for example, you choose double sand timers instead of two single ones or take action markers that require more money but fewer sand timers. Single sand timers are dropped in the tidying up phase, while double sand timers are flipped to become single sand timer markers and stay for another round. The actions are:
Arkham Horror, 8:00pm to 11:00pm -- Hosted by Peter Olsen
1-6 players
2-4 hours
All expansions will be used
*** Will incorporate various tools and software to speed up the play time and manage cards!! ***
Diplomacy!, 8:00pm to 11:00pm -- Hosted by Richard Scott
The game is like Risk but with no chance! Form alliances, make treaties, backstab your best friend!
Gaia Project, 8:00pm to 12:00am -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) Up to 4 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 4.30
b) 4 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) Gaia Project is a new game in the line of Terra Mystica. As in the original Terra Mystica, fourteen different factions live on seven different kinds of planets, and each faction is bound to their own home planets, so to develop and grow, they must terraform neighboring planets into their home environments in competition with the other groups. In addition, Gaia planets can be used by all factions for colonization, and Transdimensional planets can be changed into Gaia planets.All factions can improve their skills in six different areas of development — Terraforming, Navigation, Artificial Intelligence, Gaiaforming, Economy, Research — leading to advanced technology and special bonuses. To do all of that, each group has special skills and abilities.
Terra Mystica is one of my all-time favorite games ever..... I didn't think it could be improved upon..... Until I played Gaia Project! Now I own both! Awesome game - one of my favorite releases from Essen - if not thee favorite!
1846: The Race for the Midwest, 8:00am to 1:00pm -- Hosted by Marius van der Merwe
Number of players: 2-5, Run time: 3-5 hours
Description: 1846 is an18xx train game set in the Midwestern United States.This game has a reputation as a good entry point into the 18xx genre. Its focus is more on route building than stock market shenanigans, and for an 18xx game, plays relatively quickly. If you ever wondered what the 18xx hype is all about, this is your chance to find out. However, you should probably stay away if you hate math and numbers crunching!
Marvel Legendary, 8:00am to 11:00am -- Hosted by Charlie Zerilli
Number of players: 1-4, Run time: 60-90 Minutes
Marvel Legendary is a Deck Building game using Marvel Comics Super Heroes, Masterminds, and Villains. It is cooperative on a main mission, with each player also earning individual victory points to try and become the overall winner. Planning to play two runs of the game.
Reel Royale, (Game demos all day) -- Hosted by Andrew Smith
4 players (or more, if the players aren't new to the game) and a session usually runs a little less than half an hour.
Choose-your-character fighting card game, and all the characters are based off of old SciFi/Horror B movies.
Tokaido (Deluxe Edition), 8:00am to 11:00am -- Hosted by Rik Fontana
Number of players: 2-5, Run time: 2 games, about 90 minutes each
Take a journey through Japan and become the most traveled player. Easy to learn rules. Beginner & experienced players welcome.
Transatlantic, 8:00am to 10:30am -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) 2 to 4 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 3.15
b) 21/2 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) In Transatlantic, 2 to 4 players lead their own shipping companies, which transport freight, mail, and passengers around the globe. They purchase new steamships from the market, each of them historical with their individual technical data (tons, knots etc.). Competition is tough, especially in the North Atlantic where winning the "Blue Riband" is not only a matter of prestige, but may also be a profitable investment. In order to let a shipping company flourish, purchasing the best steamships is not enough, if one fails to acquire enough coal bunkers and trade posts as well.The game is driven by cards; on each turn, play one card and execute the related action. As new cards enter the game, build your individual deck of cards with new or improved possibilities. The task is to manage your merchant fleet most efficiently. It's a maritime strategy game with low luck, lots of interactive choices, and tough decisions.
Heroes of Kaskaria, 10:00am to 11:00am -- Hosted by Alex Bernard
Number of players: 2 - 4, Run time: 30 minutes (will run this game twice)
Easy game, beginners welcome
Evil trolls have stolen the treasure of the ancestors and the magical tribal amulet, now the Kaskarians fear the wrath of their ancestors. Brave heroes immediately set off with flying scaled griffins and fast cliff runners to reach the trolls' lair which lies at the bottom of the volcanic crater. The hero who plays their action cards cleverly, rescues as much treasure as possible, and snatches the magic amulet back from the evil trolls will become the big hero of Kaskaria!
Keyper, 11:00am to 1:30pm -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) 2 to 4 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 3.65
b) 2 1/2 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) Keyper is a worker placement game. (Keyper is the eighth new title in the medieval Key series of games, with Keydom, the second in the series being widely recognized as the first of the worker placement genre of games.) What makes Keyper special is that when one player places a keyple on a country board, another player can join them with a matching colored keyple on the first player's turn to the benefit of both players. In this way some players are likely to have played all their keyples before others. All keyples have the potential to work twice. If a player has played all of their keyples, but another player still has some, then on their turn the player with no remaining keyples can lay down one or more keyples on the country board they have claimed or in their village board to secure additional resources or actions. It can therefore be doubly beneficial to co-operate with your fellow players, although Keyper is not a co-operative game in the usual sense of the term.The country boards are also noteworthy in that they can be manipulated and folded at the beginning of summer, autumn and winter to show one of four different permutations of fields for that season. A player will chose the one to suit their strategy, often hoping that another player will complement their choice. Certain fields on the country boards are available only in certain seasons, e.g., raw materials can be upgraded to finished goods only in spring and summer after which you can only convert using tiles in your own village. Gem mining occurs only in autumn and winter.
A player's strategy is likely to be influenced by which (seeded) spring country tiles they acquire and by the particular colored keyples they have available in the later seasons. Different combinations will encourage a player to develop their farm or village, help with their shipping or mining activities, and prepare for the seasonal fairs. Players constantly need to evaluate whether or not to join other players, when to claim a country board, whether to play on their own or another player's country board, when to use their own village, and whether to create a large or small team of keyples for the following season. The winner is the player to gain the most points, usually through pursuing at least a couple of the different strategies.
In addition to the theme and mechanisms, Keyper has similar traits to the earlier Key games: Game actions are positive and constructive, not destructive; player interaction is through the game mechanisms not direct, and like Keyflower, the previous game in the series, there is a lot of player interaction.
Mage Wars, 11:00am to 2:00pm -- Hosted by Jessica Burgess
Number of players: 2-4, Run time: 2-3 hours
Mages battle to the death in an arena of magic, creatures, and traps.
Terraforming Mars, 11:00am to 2:00pm -- Hosted by Kory West
Number of players: Up to 5, Run time: 2-3 hours.
Players are corporations working to raise the temperature, place oceans, and raise the oxygen on Mars. There are many paths to victory for your corporation. You must choose wisely, what projects you sponsor and how you manage your Megacredits. There are milestones to claim and awards to fund to help you on your way to victory. I hope to have the new Venus Next Expansion!
Mansions of Madness (1st Edition), 11:00am to 2:00pm -- Hosted by John Snow
Number of players: 2 -5, Run time: 3 hrs
One vs. all haunted mansion mystery, cthulu mythos;
Anachrony, 2:00pm to 6:00pm -- Hosted by Brett Peterson
Number of players: 1-4, Run time: 4 hours
Anachrony features a unique two-tiered worker placement system. To travel to the Capital or venture out to the devastated areas for resources, players need not only various Specialists (Engineers, Scientists, Administrators, and Geniuses) but also Exosuits to protect and enhance them — and both are in short supply.
The game is played in 4-7 turns, depending on the time when the looming cataclysm occurs. The elapsed turns are measured on a dynamic Timeline. By powering up the Time Rifts, players can reach back to earlier turns to supply their past "self" with resources. Each Path has a vastly different objective that rewards it with a massive amount of Victory Points when achieved. The Paths' settlements will survive the impact, but the Capital will not. Whichever Path manages to collect most points will be the new seat for the Capital.
Anachrony is a heavy worker placement game that takes about 4 hours to play.
Emperor's Choice, 2:00pm to 4:30pm -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) 3 to 5 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 3.00
b) 2 1/2 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) In 221 BC, Emperor Qin Shihuang finally united China after a long period of internal conflict in which China was divided by warring provinces. With this unprecedented authority, Emperor Qin made a number of influential lasting reforms and carried out impactful large-scale projects which would last for centuries. Players are powerful subordinates of the Emperor, promoting the Emperor’s various policies and projects while manipulating their own standing within the Imperial Court. To do so, they need to build sections of the Great Wall, amass troops and carriages, recruit philosophers and academics as well as collect important literature. Players will also need to employ and properly utilize characters within the Imperial Court. Which player can exert the greatest influence and make their achievements go down in the annals of history?The player with the most victory points (VP) at the end of 6 rounds will be the winner. Players earn VP by presenting their achievements according to the Emperor’s policies. However, the Emperor’s policies are constantly subject to influence and change…
Taiwanese designer and a really good game!
Long Shot, 7:00pm to 8:00pm -- Hosted by Tobyn Degraw
Long Shot
3-8 players
approx 1 hour play
Welcome to the races. Gamblers and horse owners bet on horses and try to push their horse into the lead. This is a family friendly game for ages 10 and up, that involves pretend gambling.
Pandemic, 2:00pm to 3:30pm -- Hosted by John Snow
Number of players: 2 - 4 players, Run time: 1.5 hrs (including teaching time)
Cooperative game of fighting disease around the world.
Panamax, 2:00pm to 4:00pm -- Hosted by Rob Ruppert
Number of players: 2-4, Run time: 2 hours
In Panamax each player manages a shipping company established in the Colón Free Trade Zone. Companies accept contracts from both US coasts, China and Europe and deliver cargo in order to make money, attract investment and pay dividends. At the same time the players accumulate their own stock investments and try to make as much money as possible in an effort to have the largest personal fortune and win the game.
On their turn, players remove a die from the Action table to select Contracts and Load Cargo or Move ships until the pool of dice is emptied ending the Round. Over the course of three rounds these actions are blended during the turn to create a logistics network which the players use to ship their cargo, minimize transportation fees and increase the net worth of their Companies. Each Company has a limited amount of Stock that the players can purchase in exchange for investing—receiving a dividend each round. The questions for the players will be which companies are likely to yield higher dividends?
There’s more to explore and several ways to win, but we ask that you join us at the table and celebrate the 100th Anniversary of the Panama Canal with a session of Panamax!
Ticket To Ride, 2:00pm to 3:30pm -- Hosted by Joel Cottam
Dominion, 3:30pm to 5:00pm -- Hosted by Joel Cottam
Ticket To Ride
Number of players: 2-5, Run time: 1 hour
You have tickets to your destination! Fulfill those tickets by matching train cards and placing your pieces on the tracks.
Dominion
Number of players: 2-4, Run time: about 30 minutes per game
You are a monarch trying to build your kingdom by collecting card actions so you can get more gold and acquire more land. Deck building game.
Catacombs, 5:00pm to 7:00pm -- Hosted by John Snow
Number of players: 2 - 5 players, Run time: 2 hrs (including teaching time)
One vs. all dexterity (disc flipping) dungeon crawl
Gentes, 5:00pm to 7:30pm -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) 2 to 4 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 3.19
b) 2 1/2 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) Gentes is an interesting civilization game with an innovative timing mechanism."Gentes" is the Latin plural word for greater groups of human beings (e.g., tribes, nations, people; singular: "gens"). In this game, players take the role of an ancient people who are attempting to develop by building monuments and colonizing or founding new cities in the Mediterranean sea.
The game is played in six rounds, each consisting of two phases: action phase, and tidying up. There are three eras — rounds 1-2, 3-4, 5-6 — with new monument cards entering the game at the beginning of rounds 1, 3 and 5. Each player has a personal player mat with a time track for action markers and sand timer markers. In the action phase of a round, the players take their turns in clockwise order, conducting one action per turn. Each action requires an action marker from the main board that is placed on the time track. Depending on the information on the action marker, you have to also pay some money or take sand timers that are placed on the time track. When you have no free spaces on your time track, you must pass for the remainder of the round. Therefore, the number of actions per player in a single round may vary significantly if, for example, you choose double sand timers instead of two single ones or take action markers that require more money but fewer sand timers. Single sand timers are dropped in the tidying up phase, while double sand timers are flipped to become single sand timer markers and stay for another round. The actions are:
- Buy new cards from the common display
- Build monuments (playing cards from your hand to your personal display for victory points and new options)
- Train/Educate your people
- Build/found cities
- Take money
Arkham Horror, 8:00pm to 11:00pm -- Hosted by Peter Olsen
1-6 players
2-4 hours
All expansions will be used
*** Will incorporate various tools and software to speed up the play time and manage cards!! ***
Diplomacy!, 8:00pm to 11:00pm -- Hosted by Richard Scott
The game is like Risk but with no chance! Form alliances, make treaties, backstab your best friend!
Gaia Project, 8:00pm to 12:00am -- Hosted by Dion Garner
a) Up to 4 players, Complexity rating on BGG = 4.30
b) 4 hours for first time players including rules/ teaching
c) Gaia Project is a new game in the line of Terra Mystica. As in the original Terra Mystica, fourteen different factions live on seven different kinds of planets, and each faction is bound to their own home planets, so to develop and grow, they must terraform neighboring planets into their home environments in competition with the other groups. In addition, Gaia planets can be used by all factions for colonization, and Transdimensional planets can be changed into Gaia planets.All factions can improve their skills in six different areas of development — Terraforming, Navigation, Artificial Intelligence, Gaiaforming, Economy, Research — leading to advanced technology and special bonuses. To do all of that, each group has special skills and abilities.
Terra Mystica is one of my all-time favorite games ever..... I didn't think it could be improved upon..... Until I played Gaia Project! Now I own both! Awesome game - one of my favorite releases from Essen - if not thee favorite!